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Post Info TOPIC: Sucker Punch


Honoured Mook

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Sucker Punch


So I heard about the movie Sucker Punch a while back, and never thought much more about it. Two nights ago saw that it was on HBO and I was like why not? Since then I've watched it 6 times. At first you don't really get it. It looks like just a film for a guy. A bunch of girls who are wearing these very revealing outfits all the time(I'm pretty sure they are prostitutes) and go around killing these monster things. So hot girls in very revealing outfits with guns and swords. What more could (most) guys ask for? Well turns out its more than that. One it gives some saying. Ex. If you dont stand for something you'll fall for anything. Two its also about sacrifice. Its about how the world is yours if you belive it is. It is not at all like the preveiws, and the ending? Don't even try to guess the ending. I think it is a great movie. Has anybody watched it. If you have what did you think about it? What message did you get from the movie?

 



-- Edited by Peacepeep on Wednesday 4th of April 2012 11:21:36 PM

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Mookish Deity Most High

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I haven't seen it, I want to see it.

Please refrain from referring to things as "slutty". Outfits are not slutty. They are revealing, indecent, leave little to the imagination. Slutty is simply a misogynistic label for a female who enjoys having sex, something that males are rarely ever looked down on for.

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Honoured Mook

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Sorry Spikeyfaerie. I fixed it, your totally right wasn't thinking.



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Mookish Deity Most High

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I didn't think it was that hard to follow, and I thought the ending was predictable from the get go.
I like the overlapping of reality vs fantasy.
It was really sad though and poignant at times. I didn't expect it to be as morose as it was.

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Mookish Deity Most High

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I thought it was an awesome yet thought-provoking film,and far too complex to write about when half-asleep like I am now. Unlike Capulet I didn't see the ending coming,or indeed most of the plot twists. I will watch any film in which there are steampunk WW1 zombies and airship fights and giant samurai and swordfights and machine guns and robots and fighter planes and dragons and gosh dammit why can't they make a sequel or three to it? ;)

(oh yeah,the ending. damn!)

So many people mis-label this as having Nazi zombies in it though. They weren't paying attention. They're in "Dead Snow",another awesome film! (in which,at a certain point,I almost yelled "They didn't eat his brains!")

Dave.

-- Edited by skgogosfan on Thursday 5th of April 2012 12:34:45 AM

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Regular Crew

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Eh, at first it looked awesome, but now I've lost interest, due to the revealing outfits-bit. I don't like that Hollywood has produced ANOTHER movie where even if there are some good messages, the movie reduces girls to pieces of meat. I can't say too much because I haven't seen it, but still, it's annoying that they made the girls strippers in reality and then had them STILL scantily clad in fantasy. Just sayin'.

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Mookish Deity Most High

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Spoilered for... possible spoilers. What a novel concept.

Spoiler

Then again, I've not seen it all either, I've just read about it for media. The revealing clothes are part of her feeling abused in the stripper bit and will probably be about 'female empowerment' in the fantasy bits.



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Regular Crew

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While I love a good "strong woman movie", I dislike that all her fantasies involve things that look suspiciously like hentai outfits that fanboys like...Correct me if I'm wrong here.

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Seasoned Mookster

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I've wanted to see this movie but I was a little daunted by negative reviews and the fact that one of the characters is played by the female star of High School Musical. Still want to see it, but I'll just get it on Netflix.

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High Mookish Shaman

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I've got a soft spot for Sucker Punch, it was one of the films I saw on one of my first ever dates with Vulpes. He hated it mind you, but I really enjoyed it.

I agree with the little bit in A+E's spoiler.

Personally, I don't have a problem with all the revealing outfits - it's no better or worse than most other films out there these days.



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Honoured Mook

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Quite a clever film with a good storyline. Visually it was very exciting for me with the scenics and 'grubby and lived in" Manga collides with Tank Girl look to the costumes. I heard negative reviews but ignored them to make up my own mind. One of my friends who is Mr.Steampunk with everything loved the trench warfare scenes with the clockwork storm troopers. As far as revealing outfits go, my best friend Mca did last new years as Babydoll from the film in the most amazing hand made reproduction of her 'sailor moon' type outfit, I must say that he looked completely brilliant.

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High Mookish Shaman

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I LOVE IT. That is all.

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Mookish Deity Most High

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Hm, hate to disagree with the general consensus that Sucker Punch is wonderful, but I really don't see the appeal.

The characters as far as I can see are not "strong" characters- they might be kicking some ass, but that does not equal a developed, well-rounded character with true strength. The fetishistic costumed of the female characters added nothing to the film but wank bank material for the male viewer. The infantilisation of the characters by putting them in little pigtails and giving them names like Babydoll and Sweet Pea is not empowerment, regardless of how many weapons you equip them with. The plot is insipid and dull and doesn't leave much to talk about in my opinion. What could have been a compelling film about women fighting back against oppression becomes a sexualised video game scenario. The film additionally has some serious fucked-uppedness in its trivialisation of sexual assault (which is merely exploited and used to "further" what is an already dire storyline).

Repackaging strong female characters as scantily clad women crowbarred into the typical (and equally flat and poorly-developed) male action figure character role is not empowerment. This is a film made for adolescent male fantasies, pure and simple, and that pisses me the fuck off.



-- Edited by little charlie on Thursday 5th of April 2012 07:45:39 PM

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Charlie, I could not agree with you more. So much like.

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Mookish Deity Most High

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Sadly, there are only so many forumlas that practically guarantee ticket and DVD sales. Film makers don't stray out of those lines unless they're trying to jump as far out of the box as they can and label their product as 'contraversial'. Sucker Punch is a box ticker, why should they do anything else when it had done it's job and earned them money?

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Mookish Deity Most High

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It's a complex film to explain,really,since it has three levels of "reality" and switches between them regularly,but what I read it as was a tale of self-discovery and self-sacrifice. As the title suggests,the ending is not the one the first part of the film leads you to expect,as the scene with the cook derails any chance of a Disney ending.

Spoiler


It's a film that's open to interpretation in many ways,but it does make you think about what just happened and what was real and what wasn't. As far as I'm concerned,a film that makes you think is a good one. Imagine how sucky it would have been had Michael Bay directed it lol.

Was it perfect? No,there could have been more character development for sure. Despite the marketing posters,it wasn't even about female empowerment or girls kicking arse per se,because self-discovery and self-sacrifice aren't just female things,and the combat scenes were allegorical. The costumes might have been revealing,arguably,but at least they were practical for sword fighting,hand-to-hand combat,running through trenches etc etc. You can't do those things in chain mail or full-length crinolines,and although they're not clothes RL soldiers wear...RL it wasn't. I also would have loved to have seen Chuck Norris play "The Wise Man",but that's just me!

SomethingWicked wrote:

I've wanted to see this movie but I was a little daunted by negative reviews and the fact that one of the characters is played by the female star of High School Musical. Still want to see it, but I'll just get it on Netflix.





Don't be put off by that,her character is completely different.

Arlenmia wrote:

I LOVE IT. That is all.





Somehow I'm not surprised. You already have the swords! :)

Dave.

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Mookish Deity Most High

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I'm with Charlie. It makes me grumble in a cross way. Zack Snyder got to make his ultimate masturbation fantasy and get paid for it.
I would totally remake Sucker Punch. If Babydoll has already been sexually exploited why does she go to a strip club in her next level of fantasy? I would make it a library where she has to find the right book to take her into the next level of ass kicking and dragons and so forth.
But it would obviously be a lot cooler looking in the execution. :P

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Runic Mook of the North (mod)

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I thought that the sexualised videogame look of the film was a big point in the story? Babydoll is trapped in a world made by abusive men, and the entrapment is not only external but also so integrated into her mind that it reaches through 2 levels of escape-fantasies. In the western world I think that the main thing keeping women from equality and freedom is within our own minds and only when we are able to "see ourselves from the outside" and escape our own expectations of what it means to be a "woman" will we truly be free individuals.

I also saw it as a comment on lipstick feminism, questioning the assumption that the use of "female sexuality and beauty" in order to control men is an empowering personal choice and not a product of external influence. I think it is very interesting that on a feminist board like this, some people view the film as female empowerment and some view it as pandering to male fantasies.


Of course, it is quite possible that I interpreted Sucker Punch like that since I find it hard to be negative of a film that features pretty girls fighting clockwork zombie-nazies...

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Mookish Deity Most High

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skgogosfan wrote:

The costumes might have been revealing,arguably,but at least they were practical for sword fighting,hand-to-hand combat,running through trenches etc etc. You can't do those things in chain mail or full-length crinolines,and although they're not clothes RL soldiers wear...RL it wasn't. I also would have loved to have seen Chuck Norris play "The Wise Man",but that's just me!


 Please Dave, explain to me how those clothes were practical. Yes, you can't do those things in chainmail or crinolines, I fully agree, but it's not as if there were three options- chainmail, crinoline or schoolgirl fetishwear. If these clothes were truly as practical as you say they are (and trust me, having worn similar things myself, I'll tell you- they're NOT) why don't we put the male characters in similar revealing clothing when doing equivalent acts? I can't see how the outfits chosen for these women are for anything other than for 14 year old boys to gawk at.

Additionally, hating to sound a little bit radfem about this, but does anyone else find it weird that Babydoll escapes into a fantasy world to supposedly relinquish the control she has lost only to be told what to do by a man, albeit a wise one? This doesn't happen to male characters in their fantasy worlds, so why does it happen to Babydoll?

I also could go and get angry that Babydoll chooses a lobotomy (as far as I know Sweet Pea is not under the same pressures) and relinquishes all control of herself to right every single wrong in the plot.

I get your point Irilar about whether sexualised things are always for men, and I agree. Women don't always wear things like that for men- I myself wear slutty underwear for myself, and not for men. Many other people on this board do similar things or take part in things like burlesque not for the male viewer. But when it's in Hollywood and the director is male and there are so few strong female characters in film and the only female characters look like they've been lifted from Playboy and are donning guns, you're doing it wrong.



-- Edited by little charlie on Saturday 7th of April 2012 11:32:51 AM

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Mookish Deity Most High

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little charlie wrote:

Additionally, hating to sound a little bit radfem about this, but does anyone else find it weird that Babydoll escapes into a fantasy world to supposedly relinquish the control she has lost only to be told what to do by a man, albeit a wise one? This doesn't happen to male characters in their fantasy worlds, so why does it happen to Babydoll?

 

-- Edited by little charlie on Saturday 7th of April 2012 11:32:51 AM


 I thought that was really weird too. I took it to mean that this was the faith she had left in men manifesting, like maybe he was an avatar of her father or something? It sat a bit wrongly with me though.



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Souljacker can't get my soul

Left my carcass with the worms and moles

Souljacker can't get my soul

He can hang my neck from the old flagpole

But the souljacker can't get my soul.

 

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Mookish Deity Most High

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^^ Perhaps it would have bothered me less if maybe the wise man had made a cameo once- this is a trope that occurs in other films where either an ancestor or someone else who is wise makes a brief appearance in times of trouble. The thing is, the wise man is constant throughout her fantasy world mark 2, telling the girls exactly what to do. Nevermind that fantasy world mark 1 is a brothel.

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Regular Crew

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I havent seen it recently but I love this film. The soundtrack is amazing. I like how it pointed important things out first. It took me a while to understand (I still dont fully understand it, but it does not bother me) Not every film perfect but I like this film :)

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Honoured Mook

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OpheliaOfHarts wrote:

I havent seen it recently but I love this film. The soundtrack is amazing. I like how it pointed important things out first. It took me a while to understand (I still dont fully understand it, but it does not bother me) Not every film perfect but I like this film :)


 I absolutly LOVE this soundtrack. Thanks so much for bringing it up!!!!!



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Mookish Deity Most High

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Just watched it...

Spoilered so I can just waffle on about plot points.

Spoiler


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Mookish Deity Most High

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Last semester I actually wrote a thesis on Sucker Punch and whether or not it was sexualizing mental illness and if it was or was not empowering to women.

I'll spoiler it because it's long, and well, has spoilers. So if anyone wants to read it...

 

 

Spoiler

 

Also, just this.



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Honoured Mook

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Personally, I thought the film sucked. Majorly. For all the reasons that have already been mentioned. It's great wank material, but they slaughter so many brilliant songs. SO MANY. I thought that visually it was excellent, but except from being very CGI prettypretty, nothing happened. It's not about empowerment or taking control, it's about creating an imaginary work in yor head where you're powerful in order to delude yourself that reality can't bite your ass and chain you up and stick lobotomy-hammers in your brain. It's film was full on misogyny, for me. And therefore I feel very conflicted about it being really, first class soft-porn wank material.

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